Melanie Joy, PhD, is a Harvard-educated psychologist specializing in relationships, communication, and social transformation. She is the award-winning author of six books, including the bestselling Why We Love Dogs, Eat Pigs, and Wear Cows and Getting Relationships Right: How to Build Resilience and Thrive in Life, Love, and Work. Joy is also an internationally recognized speaker and trainer who’s presented her work in fifty countries across six continents. Joy is best known for her groundbreaking theories on the psychology of violence and nonviolence and building healthy relationships. Her analyses have helped explain why people engage in “nonrelational” behaviors—behaviors that harm other people, animals, the planet, and themselves—as well as how to change this pattern. Her work has been featured by media outlets around the world, including the New York Times, BBC, NPR, and ABC Australia. She is the eighth recipient of the Ahimsa Award—previously given to the Dalai Lama and Nelson Mandela—for her work on global nonviolence; and she also received both the Peter Singer Prize and the Empty Cages Prize for her work developing strategies to reduce the suffering of animals. (Text: In this podcast, philosopher Floris Schleicher interviews Melanie about how eating meat is based on a belief system, and how meat industry and politics are interconnected.


00:00:00 Introduction on Carnism / 00:03:00 A violent system / 00:07:00 Pork and Babe: spectrum of carnism / 00:12:00 The organization of veganism / 00:16:00 Collective action problem and individual responsibility / 00:18:00 Politics and meat industry / 00:21:00 Future perspectives / 00:23:00 Beyond Carnism and outro.

Recommendations and links:

Melanie Joy

Beyond Carnism

Why we love dogs, eat pigs and wear cows

Stephen Pinker: Collective Action and the Evolution of Social Norms

Mens kijkt weg van vleesschaamte nog meer dan van alcoholvrees

Please buy your books at your local bookshop : )